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  #1  
قديم 01-04-2008
The Joker The Joker غير متصل
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puzzl Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

"If I were a Muslim I would let you know," Barack Obama has said, and I believe him. In fact, he is a practicing Christian, a member of the Trinity United Church of Christ. He is not now a Muslim.

But was he ever a Muslim or seen by others as a Muslim? More precisely, might Muslims consider him a murtadd (apostate), that is, a Muslim who converted to another religion and, therefore, someone whose blood may be shed?


Barack Obama at the Smoky Row Coffee Shop in Oskaloosa, Iowa.

The candidate for president of the United States has delivered two principal statements in reply. His campaign website carries a statement dated Nov. 12 with the headline, "Barack Obama Is Not and Has Never Been a Muslim," followed by: "Obama never prayed in a mosque. He has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim, and is a committed Christian." Then, on Dec. 22, in the unlikely setting of the Smoky Row Coffee Shop in Oskaloosa, Iowa, as he munched on pumpkin pie and drank tea with four locals, Obama provided more detail took on this topic than before. When asked to explain his Muslim heritage, he replied:

My father was from Kenya, and a lot of people in his village were Muslim. He didn't practice Islam. Truth is he wasn't very religious. He met my mother. My mother was a Christian from Kansas, and they married and then divorced. I was raised by my mother. So, I've always been a Christian. The only connection I've had to Islam is that my grandfather on my father's side came from that country. But I've never practiced Islam. … For a while, I lived in Indonesia because my mother was teaching there. And that's a Muslim country. And I went to school. But I didn't practice. But what I do think it does is it gives me insight into how these folks think, and part of how I think we can create a better relationship with the Middle East and that would help make us safer is if we can understand how they think about issues.

These statements raise two questions: What is Obama's true connection to Islam and what implications might this have for an Obama presidency?

Was Obama Ever a Muslim?
"I've always been a Christian," said Obama, focusing on his own personal lack of practice of Islam as a child to deny any connection to Islam. But Muslims do not see practice as key. For them, that he was born to a line of Muslim males makes him born a Muslim. Further, all children born with an Arabic name based on the H-S-N trilateral root (Hussein, Hassan, and others) can be assumed to be Muslim, so they will understand Obama's full name, Barack Hussein Obama, to proclaim him a born Muslim.

More: family and friends considered him as a child to be Muslim. In "Obama Debunks Claim About Islamic School," Nedra Pickler of the Associated Press wrote on January 24, 2007, that

Obama's mother, divorced from Obama's father, married a man from Indonesia named Lolo Soetoro, and the family relocated to the country from 1967-71. At first, Obama attended the Catholic school, Fransiskus Assisis, where documents showed he enrolled as a Muslim , the religion of his stepfather. The document required that each student choose one of five state-sanctioned religions when registering – Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, Catholic or Protestant.

Asked about this, Obama communications director Robert Gibbs responded by indicating to Pickler that

he wasn't sure why the document had Obama listed as a Muslim. "Senator Obama has never been a Muslim."

Two months later, Paul Watson of the Los Angeles Times (available online in a Baltimore Sun reprint) reported that the Obama campaign had retreated from that absolute statement and instead issued a more nuanced one: "Obama has never been a practicing Muslim." The Times looked into the matter further and learned more about his Indonesian interlude:

His former Roman Catholic and Muslim teachers, along with two people who were identified by Obama's grade-school teacher as childhood friends, say Obama was registered by his family as a Muslim at both schools he attended. That registration meant that during the third and fourth grades, Obama learned about Islam for two hours each week in religion class.

The childhood friends say Obama sometimes went to Friday prayers at the local mosque. "We prayed but not really seriously, just following actions done by older people in the mosque. But as kids, we loved to meet our friends and went to the mosque together and played," said Zulfin Adi. … Obama's younger sister, Maya Soetoro, said in a statement released by the campaign that the family attended the mosque only "for big communal events," not every Friday.

Recalling Obama's time in Indonesia, the Times account contains quotes that Obama "went to the mosque," and that he "was Muslim."

Summarized, available evidence suggests Obama was born a Muslim to a non-practicing Muslim father and for some years had a reasonably Muslim upbringing under the auspices of his Indonesian step-father. At some point, he converted to Christianity. It appears false to state, as Obama does, "I've always been a Christian" and "I've never practiced Islam." The campaign appears to be either ignorant or fabricating when it states that "Obama never prayed in a mosque."

Implications of Obama's Conversion
Obama's conversion to another faith, in short, makes him a murtadd.

That said, the punishment for childhood apostasy is less severe than for the adult version. As Robert Spencer points out, "according to Islamic law an apostate male is not to be put to death if he has not reached puberty (cf. ‘Umdat al-Salik o8.2; Hidayah vol. II p. 246). Some, however, hold that he should be imprisoned until he is of age and then ‘invited' to accept Islam, but officially the death penalty for youthful apostates is ruled out."

On the positive side, were Obama prominently charged with apostasy, that would uniquely raise the issue of a Muslim's right to change religion, taking a topic on the perpetual back-burner and placing it front and center, perhaps to the great future benefit of those Muslims who seek to declare themselves atheists or to convert to another religion.

But would Muslims seeing Obama as a murtadd significantly affect an Obama presidency? The only precedent to judge by is that of Carlos Saúl Menem, the president of Argentina from 1989 to 1999. The son of two Muslim Syrian immigrants and husband of another Syrian-Argentine, Zulema Fátima Yoma, Menem converted to Roman Catholicism. His wife said publicly that Menem left Islam for political reasons—because Argentinean law until 1994 required the president of the country to be a member of the Church. From a Muslim point of view, Menem's conversion is worse than Obama's, having been done as an adult. Nonetheless, Menem was not threatened or otherwise made to pay a price for his change of religion, even during his trips to majority-Muslim countries, Syria in particular.

It is one thing to be president of Argentina in the 1990s, however, and another to be president of the United States in 2009. One must assume that some Islamists would renounce him as a murtadd and would try to execute him. Given the protective bubble surrounding an American president, though, this threat presumably would not make much difference to his carrying out his duties.

More significantly, how would more mainstream Muslims respond to him, would they be angry at what they would consider his apostasy? That reaction is a real possibility, one that could undermine his initiatives toward the Muslim world.

Source: http://www.danielpipes.org/article/5286

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  #2  
قديم 01-04-2008
The Joker The Joker غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

the question I've been asking myself about, why he would lie about practicing Islam?
and is a liar fit for US presidency ?


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  #3  
قديم 24-08-2008
Zagal Zagal غير متصل
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Who is Barack Obama ?, US presidential candidate

Who is Barack Obama ?, US presidential candidate


Probable U. S. presidential candidate, Barack Hussein Obama was born in
Honolulu , Hawaii , to Barack Hussein Obama, Sr., a black MUSLIM from
Nyangoma-Kogel , Kenya and Ann Dunham, a white ATHIEST from Wichita ,
Kansas.

Obama's parents met at the University of Hawaii. When Obama was two
years old, his parents divorced. His father returned to Kenya. His
mother then married Lolo Soetoro, a RADICAL Muslim from Indonesia. When
Obama was 6 years old, the family relocated to Indonesia. Obama
attended a MUSLIM school in Jakarta. He also spent two years in a
Catholic school.

Obama takes great care to conceal the fact that he is a Muslim. He is
quick to point out that, 'He was once a Muslim, but that he also
attended Catholic school.'

Obama's political handlers are attempting to make it appear that Obama's
introduction to Islam came via his father, and that this influence was
temporary at best. In reality, the senior Obama returned to Kenya soon
after the divorce, and never again had any direct influence over his
son's education.

Lolo Soetoro, the second husband of Obama's mother, Ann Dunham,
introduced his, stepson to Islam. Obama was enrolled in a Wahabi
school in Jakarta
.

Wahabism is the RADICAL teaching that is followed by the Muslim
terrorists who are now waging Jihad against the western world. Since it
is politically expedient to be a CHRISTIAN when seeking Major public
office in the United States, Barack Hussein Obama has joined the United
Church of Christ in an attempt to downplay his Muslim background.


ALSO, keep in mind that when he was sworn into office he DID NOT use the
Holy Bible, but instead the Koran
.

Let us all remain alert concerning Obama's expected presidential
candidacy.
The Muslims have said they plan on destroying the US from the inside
out, what better way to start than at the highest level - through the
President of the United States, one of their own!!!!

Please forward to everyone you know. Would you want this man leading
the free workd......?


If you do not ever forward anything else, please forward this to all
your contacts.........this is very scary to think of what lies ahead of the
United States........ better heed this and pray about it and share it.

THIS DEFINITELY WARRANTS LOOKING INTO. THE UNITED STATES WAS FOUNDED,
'ONE NATION UNDER GOD'. ALMIGHTY GOD, NOT THE GOD OF THE KORAN.
__________________
We will never be quite till we get our right.

كلمة الصليب عند الهالكين جهالة و اما عندنا نحن المخلصين فهي قوة الله "كور 1 -1:18"


( سيظل القران اعجاز لغوى فى نظر المسلمين الجهلاء فقط.
لان معظمهم لايستطيع الكتابه بدون اخطاء املائيه )


آخر تعديل بواسطة Zagal ، 24-08-2008 الساعة 11:46 PM
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  #4  
قديم 27-08-2008
Faith-Hope_Love Faith-Hope_Love غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

THIS DEFINITELY WARRANTS LOOKING INTO. THE UNITED STATES WAS FOUNDED,
'ONE NATION UNDER GOD'. ALMIGHTY GOD, NOT THE GOD OF THE KORAN



Actually it was not, the United States clearly (and it's the only country in the world with a 'written' constitution to do so) separates church and state, and makes it very clear that the nation was founded by its People, constitution written and ratified by its people (in contrast to English monarchy where the King ruled by 'divine right').

The phrase "one nation under god" was added to the pledge of allegiance, not the constitution mind you, in 1954, I think the United States was founded a long time before 1954.

I'm not an American myself so by all means correct me if I'm wrong here.
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  #5  
قديم 27-08-2008
churchill2 churchill2 غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

إقتباس:
المشاركة الأصلية بواسطة Faith-Hope_Love مشاهدة مشاركة
THIS DEFINITELY WARRANTS LOOKING INTO. THE UNITED STATES WAS FOUNDED,
'ONE NATION UNDER GOD'. ALMIGHTY GOD, NOT THE GOD OF THE KORAN



Actually it was not, the United States clearly (and it's the only country in the world with a 'written' constitution to do so) separates church and state, and makes it very clear that the nation was founded by its People, constitution written and ratified by its people (in contrast to English monarchy where the King ruled by 'divine right').

The phrase "one nation under god" was added to the pledge of allegiance, not the constitution mind you, in 1954, I think the United States was founded a long time before 1954.

I'm not an American myself so by all means correct me if I'm wrong here.
i don't care alot about the isssue of religion and iam sure that most of americans don't also care about it
but i believe that i can't vote for someone who might have a connection with a certain ideology iam having awar against it
__________________
Eine kleine Traene von KOPTEN ist so teuer

علينا ان ننتقل من التفكير فيما نتمني ان يفعلة لنا العدو ,الي ما يجب ان نفعلة لنجبر العدو علي ان ينفذ ما نتمناة
واظن ان اول ما سنجنية من هذا التفكير هو البدء بتكوين تنظيمات قبطية مسلحة
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  #6  
قديم 30-08-2008
Faith-Hope_Love Faith-Hope_Love غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

i don't care alot about the isssue of religion and iam sure that most of americans don't also care about it
but i believe that i can't vote for someone who might have a connection with a certain ideology iam having awar against it


Hi churchill2,

your reply raises two questions for me,

first, it appears to me that americans very much care about the religion of anybody they vote for public office (president, congressman or judge), or at least that's how it appears to a foreigner like me, where are you looking from and how do you see it?

second, how is obama's schooling (which he had no hand in choosing) more important than his adult choices?

btw, I'm not american as i mentioned earlier so i don't have a horse in this race, but it seems to me that if the war on terrorism is your priority then there are plenty of 'good' reasons to not vote for obama, without having to speculate about his childhood and how it will affect his decisions. Daniel Pipes explicitly avoids this speculation in his article towards the end.


By The way, could you please tell me what "Eine kleine Traene von KOPTEN ist so teuer" means? Google can't translate it
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  #7  
قديم 30-08-2008
churchill2 churchill2 غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

إقتباس:
it appears to me that americans very much care about the religion of anybody they vote
hope u read my post before u reply
i said
إقتباس:
i don't care alot about the isssue of religion and iam sure that most of americans don't also care about it
the civilized world now realized that islam is not a relgion but is a barbaric ideology which should be eliminated so iam sure that the americans will not allow to be controlled by a man who might have a connection with this ideology
__________________
Eine kleine Traene von KOPTEN ist so teuer

علينا ان ننتقل من التفكير فيما نتمني ان يفعلة لنا العدو ,الي ما يجب ان نفعلة لنجبر العدو علي ان ينفذ ما نتمناة
واظن ان اول ما سنجنية من هذا التفكير هو البدء بتكوين تنظيمات قبطية مسلحة
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  #8  
قديم 13-11-2009
HAMOUKAS HAMOUKAS غير متصل
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Buyer's Remorse, Democrat Arrogance






Last week's big Republican victories in New Jersey and Virginia proved what the Obama Administration's apologists in the liberal mainstream media have been avoiding telling you -- the bloom is off the Barack Obama rose.

As hard as the White House and leftist pundits try to spin Election Day's results, there's no arguing the big change in voter attitudes toward the Obama Agenda.

In 2008, Barack Obama carried Virginia by 6%, and the Democrat stronghold of New Jersey by 14%.

Last week? New Jersey's GOP candidate for governor Chris Christie bested incumbent Democrat Jon Corzine by 4 percentage points, and in Virginia, Republican Bob McDonnell defeated his Democrat opponent by 18 points -- that's a 24% turnaround!

Friend, Barack Obama won election last year, aided by his claims of moderation and transparency, and the huge cover he received from the adoring liberal media. Many Americans gave the relatively unknown first term Illinois senator the benefit of the doubt, and are now coming to regret it.

Instead of centrist policies, they have seen an extreme far-left assault on private enterprise and personal liberties. From pork barrel "stimulus" to unprecedented government spending and debt, and auto company takeovers to the present attempt at a socialist seizure of health care.

In New Jersey and Virginia, the voters have realized their mistake -- and sent a clear message to the Obama Democrats. When polled in both states about their votes for the Republican candidate, 68% and 74% respectively agreed that they were sending a message to the Obama team that they were "unhappy with the direction they are taking Washington and the country."

But are the Democrats listening? Not a chance. Instead, despite losing in two states where Democrats had controlled the governor's mansion for years, Nancy Pelosi arrogantly declared "We won!" Then she and her leftist followers dismissed the clear will of the people and rammed their socialist health care takeover scheme through the House of Representatives on Saturday.

Our victories last week are a great start, but as long as the radical Obama-Pelosi liberals are determined to force their socialist agenda on the American people, our work isn't done.

You can help our Party spread the word about the Obama-Pelosi Democrats' disastrous, arrogant plans, and help us recruit the commonsense, conservative Republican candidates today who will defeat them in next year's crucial mid-term elections
.

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  #9  
قديم 18-01-2017
sandrawilson sandrawilson غير متصل
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مشاركة: Was Barack Obama a Muslim?

If you still have doubts or certain hesitations about Barack Obama, you may read one of the most interesting articles ever - it is accessible at http://bigpaperwriter.com/blog/essay-about-barack-obama
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